Episode Thumbnail
Episode 96  |  37:20 min

Living Well in Community with Jennifer Chapman and Deseri Garcia

Episode 96  |  37:20 min  |  05.21.2021

Living Well in Community with Jennifer Chapman and Deseri Garcia

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This is a podcast episode titled, Living Well in Community with Jennifer Chapman and Deseri Garcia. The summary for this episode is: <p>This week, Rebecca is joined by Jennifer Chapman and Deseri Garcia. Jennifer is a successful sales woman who suffered a stroke, and Deseri is a personal and professional coach and team builder. Today they discuss their profound story of Jennifer reaching out to Deseri to help process the emotions of going through a traumatic life event. Tune in now to hear these women share inspirational stories to help fuel your soul. </p><p><br></p><p>Join the Online Community&nbsp;</p><p><a href="http://www.badasswomenscouncil.community/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="color: rgb(17, 85, 204);">www.badasswomenscouncil.community</a></p><p><br></p><p>Let’s work together&nbsp;</p><p><a href="http://www.wethrive.live/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank" style="color: rgb(17, 85, 204);">www.WEthrive.live</a>&nbsp;</p>
Takeaway 1 | 01:18 MIN
You Must Acknowledge Your Emotions
Takeaway 2 | 00:20 MIN
We Don't Have to Apologize for Crying
Takeaway 3 | 00:29 MIN
Having the Awareness of "I Need to Fuel My Soul"
Takeaway 4 | 00:25 MIN
We Need Community and Support, Don't be Afraid to Ask for It

This week, Rebecca is joined by Jennifer Chapman and Deseri Garcia. Jennifer is a successful sales woman who suffered a stroke, and Deseri is a personal and professional coach and team builder. Today they discuss their profound story of Jennifer reaching out to Deseri to help process the emotions of going through a traumatic life event. Tune in now to hear these women share inspirational stories to help fuel your soul.

Join the Online Community 

www.badasswomenscouncil.community

Let’s work together 

www.WEthrive.live 

Guest Thumbnail
Deseri Garcia
Team Building, Coaching, Leadership Development, W/MBE Certified
While I provide a wide range of services for both professional and personal effectiveness, my main areas of focus are: executive and personal coaching; experience-based team building; and customized leadership development programs.
Connect with Des
Guest Thumbnail
Jennifer Chapman
Stroke Warrior, Founder of Just Commit Coaching, Director for Select Senior Care
My goal is to connect, build relationships, and bring my passion and competitive drive to the highest level personally and professionally every day.
Connect with Jennifer

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: (singing). Hey, this is Rebecca Fleetwood Hession, host of the Badass Womens Council podcast. Did you know the Badass Womens Council is not just a podcast, but it also is an online community that you can jump into as a career woman so that you can enjoy reflection and connection in more practical, tactical ways? You can go to badasswomenscouncil. community and join for free. We have a weekly session called Talking With Humans every Thursday at 3: 30 Eastern Time, and also a paid subscription if you want to kick it up a notch and join the Masterclass, the Badass Masterclass. So we'd love to see you there. Jump in. Hey, on today's episode, we have Jiff Chapman and Des Garcia. Jiff has a profound story of being wildly successful in a corporate sales career and suffering a stroke, which obviously isn't something that she saw coming, and how reaching out to a coach, Des, profoundly impacted her ability to process this life event and how it has transformed her career today. So this is the story of reflection and connection. Here we go. Hello, ladies. How's it going?

Des Garcia: Great.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Jiff, how are you?

Jiff Chapman: So good.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Good. So we've got Jiff and Des on the show today. I don't often have multiple guests on the show, but it is one of my favorite things because it's just layered and lovely and rich when we can have more voices and more parts to the story. So today we're going to talk about what it means to live well in community. We're going to talk about what it means to reach out and ask for help. We just have a lot of this... Y'all's story is the epitome of reflection and connection, which is the tagline of the podcast. So just to set the stage a little bit, Jiff, this starts out as your story, and then you bring Des in. Tell us a little bit about you and your story and some of the things that you've been through that have gotten us to this place to talk about connection.

Jiff Chapman: Yeah. Thank you so much. I am born and raised in Indianapolis and graduated Ball State in'04 and-

Des Garcia: Chirp, chirp.

Jiff Chapman: And started the... I spent 15 years in corporate sales and was excelling at every position that I had and moving up the ranks. My best year was in 2016, I hit the pinnacle of sales. I hit President's Club, and I didn't know how much weight that carried on a professional level until after I did it. And I say that because it was right around my birthday in June when I turned 34... And I just want to set the stage with inaudible that realization when I was 34 of losing my mom, because she was 34 when she passed. So although I'm on this professional high, I had this moment, this epiphany like," Oh my gosh, I'm 34. Yes, I'm doing well. I take care of myself, but I feel so young still. I still have so much I want to do and achieve and be. And my mom was 34." And I just remember I was 11 at the time. So all I knew as a kid, that was already a challenging experience in and of itself. But yeah, I have that epiphany. So nine months later, I'm cruising along and still thriving in my sales career and was getting ready to step into a new role with that company in March of 2017. I'm getting ready to start it on a Thursday. I just remember on Wednesday, I went for a four or five- mile run, feeling really good, nothing off base. And then that Thursday morning waking up, and I was home by myself at the time and just got overwhelmingly dizzy and sweating profusely through my clothes, like really quickly, like all within a couple of minutes. And I remember laying down thinking," I know this isn't right, but I'm going to hope that it subsides and goes away and we'll address it later." And a couple more minutes went by, and it didn't. The dizziness got worse. And I called my aunt, who is my person aside from my dad. She was my mom's sister, and just I always had a really close relationship with her. And I called her, and I'm like," Something isn't right." And she's like," You don't sound right." And I could feel my throat closing. I mean, I could feel it was getting harder to swallow, but luckily your body doesn't go into panic mode. You just know it's like literally one minute after the next, one step at a time. So she's like," Call 911. I'll meet you at the hospital." So I did, and they got here quickly. Got into an ambulance and went to the hospital. I think the unfortunate thing of being 34 is they did not think stroke right away, and the first neurologist walked in and wrote me off as vertigo.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Oh, my God.

Jiff Chapman: And that was it. So they put me in this observation room for 10 to 12 hours. And with stroke, time is everything. So when we were informed that Thursday night, which I don't remember this, my family... My neurologist said," She's had a stroke." No one in my family's ever had a stroke. I've never even heard that word before. So the next few days were really crucial. I was in ICU. I don't remember much. I couldn't eat anything. They were really still just trying to diagnose what all has now occurred with the stroke. So after about a week... My brain didn't process much, I can tell you. I just remember I had lots of family and friends visit me. I did not recognize the fact that I wasn't able to walk or really eat. I just remember feeling some pain still. And then I was taken by ambulance to Community North Rehab across the street, realizing," Okay, I'm going to have to now do some intense therapy here on some things that I'm going to have to relearn." So I did that. Was on the soft diet, learning how to literally walk because my balance was affected, so walking a straight line and not feeling dizzy. And I didn't know then, until I then transitioned into outpatient therapy, that I lost 40% of my vision. I knew we were doing therapy behind visual loss, but they did not tell me specifically 40% of this is gone on your left side.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Wow!

Jiff Chapman: So then outpatient therapy. I went through that for about four months. I would say I was an overachiever just from the competitiveness that lives within me. The emotional part hadn't come yet. I had seen my family and friends around me be really emotional at times and probably processing it completely different than I was. And I remember telling my therapist," I can't cry right now if I wanted to. Nothing's happening." And she's like," That's okay. Your brain is still healing. It will come. It will happen when it's ready to happen." So long story short, I went back to work, and I think I just wanted to feel normal and have some routine. And then after the year mark, the one- year anniversary in March, I saw my neurologist, and the tears flowed out of control. I just could not get a grip. And from a neurologist's standpoint, she didn't understand that. She was like," What do you need? Do you want drugs? What can I do for you?" And I'm like," I'm not ready for the drugs yet. Let's try some therapy." And she's like," Okay, I'll refer you." So she did. I had a couple of different options. Went to those. Again, I was walking in emotionally drained, and after an hour with them, I walked out completely emotionally drained and would have to go home and go to bed. I was exhausted, fatigued, all of it. So that wasn't working. So after conversation with one of my best friends, she's like," What about a life coach?" And I'm like," I'm totally open to that. I'm open to anything." I had only known of one other woman to have a life coach, and she was the VP of our company, and she talked about her life coach all the time. So I was like," Okay, let's do this." So she introduces me to Des, and really through that first conversation of her explaining to me what coaching is, which is she was going to meet me where I am and then moving me forward to the next level, to the next level of accepting this new version of me, embracing it, and really just moving me forward. So that is where Des came into my life in the summer of 2018.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Let's unpack this a little bit. This is a situation where high- achiever mode. You went from President's Club, and now you're in this," What is happening with my body?" moment. But you stayed in high- achiever mode, right? So you really weren't processing the emotions because you were in that we're going to go through the therapy. We're going to fix it. We're going to do it. We're going to... All the things, right? Get back to work, get achieving again, which is typically the focus of most people that listen to this podcast, right? We're high- achieving career women. But at some point the emotions finally surfaced. And this is an important point that I really want to underscore because this is the case for most of us, whether you're going through trauma, like you did, or whether you're just in a heightened state of stress that you've normalized over time, is when we don't acknowledge our emotions, they will find us, right? We are wired as humans to be personal, emotional, and social. Emotions are a key part of our strategy. They're a key part of our lives. We can't just put them to the side when they're inconvenient. And that's really what... It took a year, but a year later, all of a sudden, you're like,"I've got to do something with this." So that's point number one. Point number two is I love that you said," Hey, I want some therapy," instead of just accepting whatever medication and let's just keep numbing this thing out, right?" Oh my gosh, I've got emotions. I'm sure there's a pill for those emotions." How is that where we are as a society? Like, it's numb out our emotions. Don't even get me started on that one today. And then the third one is, with therapy, you didn't have the results that you were looking for because you were looking towards the future instead of looking at the past. And that's something that we've talked about and why I wanted you and Des to be on together today, is to talk about that kind of relationship. So enter Des into the picture. So Des, tell us a little bit about your approach with this, because this is a little bit different than some of the work that you and I do in the corporate space. What was your approach when you started working with Jiff on this?

Des Garcia: Well, I love the three big takeaways that you just mentioned, Rebecca. I just have to say, I was so taken back by Jiff's story. It's kind of one of those things. It's like, whew, that really captures you, and it's like how can I... I've got to be with this person, not get so tied up in the story that I can't make a difference, because like Jiff said, she at first had no emotions, couldn't cry, and then it didn't stop. I mean, I think when we first said hello in that coffee shop, it was like," Hi," and it was like boosh. The tears were rolling.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: She shared that with me the first time we talked. She was like," I think I cried the entire first episode." Or first episode! The first session.

Des Garcia: Well, the first few episodes, the first season. The first-

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: crosstalk.

Des Garcia: Yeah. Yeah. So your question, Rebecca, was what was it like for me?

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Yeah. What was your approach? What were you thinking?

Des Garcia: Ah, my approach, truly, like Jiff said, like meet her where she is. I knew that she... With everything she'd been through and knowing that she is competitive as all get out, I got that from her telling my story, I knew that she wanted to get back to... Get back to is not the right place, but wanted to move forward. I also knew, though, that some acceptance. Do you remember the question I was asking you and you really didn't like it, Jiff? But I was like," This happened for a reason, and what is it?" And she didn't-

Jiff Chapman: I'm so sorry to interrupt. What a profound moment it was! I'll never forget it. You looked at me and said," Did you ask..." Hopefully, this is the right one you're talking about.

Des Garcia: Go ahead. Yeah, it is.

Jiff Chapman: But you said," Did you ever ask yourself why me?" I know I said," I didn't ask myself that. I just saw everyone around me asking that. Like, why Jiff? How has it happened to her?" And you said," Why don't you ask yourself why not you?" And you just said it with distinction, and I then was not ready to wrap my head around that, because I was a bawling disaster. But I wanted to. I wanted to know the purpose for this happening. And you also said," Things aren't happening to you. They're happening for you. This happened for you."

Des Garcia: That's right.

Jiff Chapman: So then I had to wrap my head around that.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Well, and this... You said," I was a bawling mess." I think that, in and of itself, is... As high achievers as well, we think that when tears and emotion overflow like that, that we're failing. And I think what Des and I love to recognize, help people recognize is that is a natural part of the human experience, and it's not failure. It's processing. I want us to become so much more comfortable showing and experiencing our emotions. And because it's really hard to do that for ourselves, the fact that you were willing and interested and eager to reach out and work with someone like Des speaks to your high achiever- ness. You're like," Help me." So I think this is a beautiful union, the way it came together, and you're just honoring that that's where she was.

Des Garcia: Yeah, it's... And I mean, honor. Yeah. I mean, for us, for all of us, we're all coaches, what an honor it is to come alongside someone, whether it's personal coaching or leadership/ executive coaching, but what an honor to be able to come along someone and truly support and impact and help them on their journey. I mean, it's like does it get any better than that? No.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Absolutely.

Des Garcia: No.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Absolutely. And I think that you're right; we are all coaches. And I think as a part of the human experience and especially as career women supporting one another, when we can see it that way, whether it's your friend that has called you and had a difficult conversation with her boss, or whether it's somebody that's vying for a promotion, if we can just be in that space with them and honor that part of their story without feeling the need to fix or improve or change or really do anything, but just sit with them in it, I think that's the biggest gift that we can give each other. And I know, like you, there are days that at the end of a really great coaching day, I just sometimes cry myself. And I just thank God that he's given me the opportunity to serve in that way, because it does feel like a sacred space sometimes. And this story, more than any that I've heard from a coaching perspective, spoke to my heart in that way. So I appreciate you two coming on to talk about it.

Des Garcia: Well, she's a rock star. I mean, just the courage that she has and just commitment, her commitment to herself and that journey is... It's extraordinary. I do want to say one thing you said earlier, Rebecca, about emotions because you made me think about, I had a coach years ago that... I don't know. I was probably crying in a coaching session, and I was like," Oh..." You know how you apologize?" I'm sorry." And she was like-

Jiff Chapman: Des, how many times did I apologize to you? I apologized every single time.

Des Garcia: Every time. Like, many times.

Jiff Chapman: Yeah." I do not want to be doing this right now."

Des Garcia: Right.

Jiff Chapman: inaudible.

Des Garcia: Do you remember what I said? Because I echoed back what a coach said to me. I said," Don't worry about it. Tears are just our body's way of releasing stress, releasing that anxiety or whatever we're feeling." And I'm like," It's a nat..." It should be a natural thing for us to do and not have to apologize for it.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: In fact, once I learned that way too late in my life, by the way, like in the last few years, and I just turned 55. Now that I know that, if I'm feeling just wound up in whatever way, in a good way, in a challenging way, anxiety, whatever it is, wound up, I will put on The Notebook or something and just let that shit fly because it is, it is a release. It is just leaving it all out there in an exhausted way that I can then just crawl in bed, exhausted from the tears, and wake up refreshed and new. Like, I use it now as a strategy.

Des Garcia: That's awesome. Yeah, that's really cool.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Okay. So that was a cliffhanger we left everybody on. So you hit her with these profound questions that she'd never thought about before. So then what? What happens next? Jiff?

Jiff Chapman: Many, many sessions later, I think it was defining my why. And I remember being in the corporate environment, and what I loved about the company I worked for was that was important to them, was to occasionally go around the table, go around the room, and it would get deep. And that's what I love. People could bring out that raw emotion because a lot of the times, it would make you emotional. What is important to you? Why do you get up every day? Why do you go to work? And many of my coworkers around the table, if they have kids, that's typically your why. That's why you get out of bed. And as a person who does not have children... That was the game plan ever since I met my husband. And I knew that I loved him a lot, but that wasn't my why. That wasn't why I got up. So I really struggled sometimes to define it before, and then working with Des... And I mean, again, another moment was saying," My mom passed at 34 through something tragic, and I survived something at 34. It is now my purpose and my why to honor her legacy and to pay it forward to others that are going through something I've already been through and can help them get to the other side." I don't know if you remember that, Des, doing that-

Des Garcia: I do.

Jiff Chapman: Doing the seven layers deep, seven levels deep of getting to that moment of that's my why.

Des Garcia: Yeah.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: And there's a lot of... Well, Simon Sinek's book, Start With Why, has been a huge catalyst for these conversations. Now, the" why" conversation has been happening in corporate America and in coaching for a while, but it's really become normalized, which I love. And it is a significant part of both a grounding as well as a processing. And I work with my clients in that way too. And I think what's important about your story is that that trauma, tragedy, the great disruption of your life also needed a why statement. So why statements don't always have to be this corporate- y, mission- y kind of stuff. Having a why for anything helps you process through it and ground you in it. So I love that that's the result that you got to with Des. Des, anything that you remember about it? And again, I want to highlight, you can't do this stuff on your own. If we would have sent you away, Jiff, and said," Now go off and think amongst... Think on this for a little bit. We're going to give you a few weeks. We'll send you out to the mountains with a journal. You come back with all your why," that's the worst idea ever. We are not meant to live in isolation. Nobody thrives alone.

Des Garcia: Exactly right. Yeah.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: So Des coming alongside you was really the reason you could get there. Des, what do you remember about that process?

Des Garcia: One of the things I was thinking before this, before recording was like," I hope I remember all those salient moments that Jiff is going to bring up," and here's why. Not that they weren't incredibly meaningful. And by the way, I do remember all of them. But it's like you're in the moment, right? You're in the moment. And you don't maybe know the exact question that you asked, but arrive... Like, being curious, like the root word... So curiosity, the root word in curiosity is to care. So just arriving curious, and as I was saying earlier, I had to get out of my own way about Jiff's story to ask the questions that I knew that... It's like here come more tears. But what I do remember is... And you know, a willingness to want to uncover is so, so, so important. And I do remember just how Jiff was, even if it wasn't in the moment, she was still willing to say," I'm going to go back. I'm going to think about this. We're going to come back to that question and do the work." Right? And we can get to those places in our lives, let's say, that we want to go if we have a willingness to step into the uncertainty and muster up whatever courage it takes for us to get there. So that's what I... What I really remember is just her willingness.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Mm- hmm( affirmative). And the curiosity piece is so important. And again, this process can be applied. You don't have to be a professional coach to honor someone with some curiosity about their story, right?

Des Garcia: Yep.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: And what I love about honoring people's stories is that when we can do the work, as you did, Jiff, to step into this, when we can do the work for ourselves to really dig in and peel back the layers to get to that why and get to that inner knowing, it's impossible to emerge from that experience without some curiosity about other people's stories, right? So it evokes this sense of empathy for others that we may not have had before. Jiff, anything about that that resonates with you?

Jiff Chapman: I believe that's spot on. And as a newer coach, the people that I've already connected with is that they see that within me, that I can feel that with them and not just feel that before them, and just understand the difference between sympathy and empathy, but to really get it, because it does take me four years to stand proud in my story, in the chapters that I've had in my book thus far. But when it resonates with someone, I mean, that connection is just going to be that much stronger in knowing like," Yeah, I want to be where she is. I'm willing." Like you said, the key is wanting to do it. And some of those other, say, stroke survivors out there, that's just not where their mindset is yet. They still want to go back to the old styles. They want to go back to what things were like before, and it's realizing that's not going to happen. Until you realize that and you're wanting to accept and embrace this new version of you, you're going to stay stuck.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: So you have become a coach because of this experience, both with your own situation as well as the great experience that Des was able to provide for you as your coach. So how's it going? I love that evolution of this story. How's it going to now be the coach?

Jiff Chapman: Yeah. I'm so proud of myself. And again, to talk to Des about that the huge piece I was struggling with... Well, there was a lot I was struggling with. But a key component of that was my own confidence and knowing that I was capable of doing it. And I knew from meeting one to the end that she believed in me so much more than I was believing in myself. And that got stronger as we went through our sessions. But to now overcome that... Not that I still don't deal with a little bit of self- doubt now going through this coaching process, but to look back and see where I've come, yeah, I'm really proud of that and really want to help others to overcome that self- doubt that they have and that lack of confidence, and to believe that they can do whatever they want to do and still reach their full potential and more if they want to. So coaching has been... I'm going through a certification right now. I'm in month three of it and loving the community of women that I am a part of because they all have their own stories. And right now, we're all doing the work on ourselves, which I love. It's understanding the tools that we're being provided. That way, in the next few months, I will then have more confidence and credibility to utilize these tools with my clients.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: I love that. And there's levels to this, right? When you talk about confidence, there are levels that you'll get to a place of some confidence. And then all of a sudden, you'll have a new challenge, and you'll be reaching out to Des again and saying," Okay, so help me get to this next level." And the next time it may be somebody else, but we don't ever just check the box on that confidence thing, right? There's something else coming around the corner that's going to challenge us in a new way. And that's part of the human experience as well. I have found the coaching community the most abundant, beautiful set of people I've ever met in my life. And people have even asked me before," Why do you have other coaches on the show? Isn't that competition for what you do?" And I quickly say," If you're a great coach, competition is not the conversation. We all know that we have... There's a market for each one of us, and we're here to support each other in whatever way we can."

Des Garcia: Absolutely.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: That's the way the world's supposed to work.

Des Garcia: Mm- hmm(affirmative).

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: So Jiff, are you planning to work with stroke survivors as a part of your practice?

Jiff Chapman: I am certainly open to it. I have connected and had virtual intros with several stroke survivors, to be honest, over these last few months. And the ones I've connected with that are open enough to even hop on that call already seem to be in a really good place and have overcome... I always say, I mean, the physical part comes first. You really overcome and accept that part first. And then it's the mental and emotional work to be done after that. So they weren't really who I knew I wanted to work with or needed to work with. And the stroke survivors that are out there that I feel like I would have the opportunity, they're the ones that aren't ready. They're the ones that don't want it. I mean, the stroke survivor groups that I'm on in Facebook, it could be at a really high level and we're celebrating the small wins, or it could be a really dark place. And to be honest and transparent, that's a hard, for me, place to be in, is to see what they're being open enough in saying, and they don't have the support, and their spouses have left them, and family and friends. They're isolated. They don't have anybody. And their head space is in really poor shape. And I struggle to say something that's going to be motivational, where they're going to be like," Yep. That made sense. I'm going to not sulk anymore." But the women that have reached out are the ones that understand me from the standpoint of, yes, I was able to go back to corporate sales, but through those next few months while I was working with Des, it was just like I no longer knew... I was no longer fulfilled selling floor mats and restroom supplies, if you can believe that. I was like," This is not my calling anymore." And she believed it, and she told me that I was going to be a coach before I even-

Des Garcia: I remember you telling me that. Yeah.

Jiff Chapman: ...knew I was going to be one.

Des Garcia: Yeah.

Jiff Chapman: Yeah. But the women are like," I feel that. I have a husband. I have kids. I've got a great- paying job. But, man, something's missing. I'm not fueling my soul like I know I could be." And I love that. I love knowing, A, you've got the awareness already, but maybe you need that person in your corner that can help you envision that. And I get chills thinking about it just because I know there's already one girl that's already made a move in the short amount of time of us talking, where she's like," I'm doing the damn thing."

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Yes. I love that.

Des Garcia: That's awesome. I do too.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: And I'm-

Des Garcia: Rock on.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: ...guessing that there's probably lots of people listening that know a stroke survivor or know there's somebody in their family or their circle of friends. And there is that dark pit of I want it to go back to the way it used to be. And you were able to work with Des on reframing what the future will look like. But if there was somebody that was listening today that wanted to support someone going through that healing process, is that a key part of it, is just being able to look at someone and just sit with them in it and not have them feel the need to want to pressure them to go back to the way it was? Is that a gift that they could give, is to say," Hey, you don't have to go back to the way it was, but what could the future be?" And maybe I'm fishing in a place that there's nothing to be had here. But I would love to think that there's some way that we could help somebody that's in that dark place by providing their friend or family member with a little nugget of something that would help them help others maybe.

Jiff Chapman: Yeah. I can just say I was blessed with a very supportive husband and supportive family and friends. And they would call me, or they would take my call, and here I am crying out of control. And I know if they could do something more, they would have. And they were just listening, and they were there for me, but it was like I needed another person. I needed someone that I knew could help me out of this. And it was having this non- biased, non- judgemental person to support me in where I was. I think people just, yeah, they want to be seen and they want to be heard and understood without judgment or bias. So yeah, it's definitely just them being open and wanting to move forward and get out of the stuck they're in. I mean, open dialogue.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Yeah. And I think we do put too much pressure sometimes as either entrepreneurs or career women, whatever, that our spouses or our family members are our go- to for all the conversations. And I found, I learned the hard way that those aren't always our best resources for those conversations. It's better to have an unbiased coach and somebody that we can reach out and have those kinds of challenging convos with.

Des Garcia: True.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Des, anything you want to say to wrap up our episode today in terms of your support of Jiff or just coaching in general?

Des Garcia: Gosh, that's a... Wow! You're asking a coach if they can say anything about that.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: That's a big question.

Des Garcia: Yeah. I'm going to echo... I'm going to springboard off what Jiff said and just echo... I ended up just a couple of months ago, I have a really good friend who had a stroke, and the first person I called was Jiff. And I said," Hey, I'm going to need some coaching here," because I found myself not knowing what to do, and I knew... So Jiff was the first person I'd worked with who was a stroke survivor at the stage she was at. I may have worked with a stroke survivor before, but they were maybe further along. But my friend is just like two months from having a stroke. So I went to Jiff. So that, in itself, is like," I'm going to a third party." And I just said," What's the best way for me to support?" And Jiff was like," Just be there with her and be supportive any way that you can." And I said, I'm like," Should I send notes and letters?" She's like," Sure." And she goes," And when you have the chance, you can ask her what she needs from you." And I'm like," That's perfect."

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Isn't it amazing how it all is connected in some way that we don't know until we need it.

Des Garcia: Yeah. I mean, you say it all the time. We need community. Maybe it's your inner circle community, or maybe it's just right outside of that inner circle.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: And whatever you're going through today, don't be afraid to reach out because the chances are that somebody is wanting to support you and willing and would just be open, like Jiff was open to say," Help me."

Des Garcia: Yes.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: I love you ladies so much. This was such a great conversation.

Des Garcia: That's so great.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: I'm proud of-

Jiff Chapman: Yes.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: ...both of you and the work that you do and that I get to know you and share your story.

Des Garcia: Wow! We get to know you, let's be clear. And it's cool for me to just be... continue to be a part of Jiff's journey to see what she's doing now. So I really appreciate that opportunity.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Awesome.

Des Garcia: It's really cool.

Jiff Chapman: Oh, I've thoroughly enjoyed this conversation. I am honored to know you, Rebecca. And Des, I mean, you are my true mentor and friend, and you've just been a blessing.

Des Garcia: And soon to be coaching client when you start coaching me.

Jiff Chapman: Yes.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Love it. Full circle.

Jiff Chapman: crosstalk.

Des Garcia: That's right. That's right.

Rebecca Fleetwood Hession: Thanks, ladies.( singing).

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