Unlocking Digital Marketing Success in Fashion with Yours Clothing

Alice Tomasevic: Hi, everyone. Welcome to Individuality. Is it that... I forgot the name of the podcast.

Alice Tomasevic: Great start. What is it again?

Janine Quinn: Individuality Unleashed?

It is. Okay. I thought, you know when you panic and you're like, is it individuality or individual? Okay. Hi, everyone. Welcome to Individuality Unleashed today. I'm Alice Tomasevic. I'm one of our strategic customer success directors here at Wunderkind, and with me today I've got Janine Quinn from Yours Clothing. So today, we're going to talk about the plan for Yours Clothing, for 2023, and the successes that you've seen so far, and then where will it go and beyond.

Janine Quinn: Exciting.

Alice Tomasevic: Great. So to kick things off, so first thing I wanted to ask you was around the rising digital advertising costs. It's something we know that it's very prominent in the industry now. It's been talked about a lot, particularly when we're looking at the state of the economy globally. So how have rising digital advertising costs, across the platforms, like Facebook, Google, how is that impacting Yours Clothing and the strategy that you're looking to achieve across your marketing spend?

Janine Quinn: Yep. So obviously, our marketing budget has increased for 2023. We are seeing growth still, so it makes sense for us to keep raising that budget, and it has become a lot more expensive on those paid channels, paid social, PPC. I think cost per acquisition is going up. We do have strict ROI targets, so we do open up ROI in peak periods, so that's May to July, and then Black Friday, Christmas kind of time. One thing we're hoping to utilize a bit more is audiences across our database and sharing them with our agencies so they can target. I think retention is going to be a big one for us this year. So as much as we're acquiring new customers, I think sometimes, we almost forget that we've got the existing database and we actually want to keep them from defecting.

Alice Tomasevic: So very much around leveraging that audience segmentation to just essentially get more efficient in how you're planning effectively spend over the coming years. Great. That's definitely something we're seeing across a lot of our clients, particularly when we're looking at their reliance on own channels. We're definitely seeing that going up over time, so it's good to hear it from yourself in terms of that's definitely something that's interesting for Yours Clothing. A big thing that's being talked about at the moment, in particular, is some of the recent privacy changes that Apple iOS are implementing and will probably continue to implement going forward. How does that affect your approach to digital advertising platforms?

Janine Quinn: I think it is so much harder to start identifying people. I think that's where Wunderkind is really coming in for us. I think with the depreciation of third- party cookies and with all of the privacy changes, it's just going to get harder. So if we are spending all that money getting people to come to our site, we actually want to serve them the correct onsite campaign, make sure they're identified. I think, it's probably in the past we've used maybe a pop- up that just shows to everyone very generic. Whereas, we've been given this strategy where we can actually identify our customers and make sure the right message is getting across.

Alice Tomasevic: Perfect. And that's definitely something I want to talk to you in a little while about the strategy and how we really tailored that for Yours, so we'll definitely come onto that. Given some of these challenges that we've just spoken about, how is that impacting where you allocate your spend across these various channels? So when we think around PPC, when we think around paid social, we're hearing lots of different things from different brands, but one of the things that's a common theme is definitely that rising cost per acquisition. So how are you at Yours combating that?

Janine Quinn: I think as much as we are utilizing paid social and PPC, we probably see that paid social isn't as effective for us now as it has been in the past. So some of that spend has been reallocated to paid ads and Google advertising, just because we are seeing a much more effective return on investment there.

Alice Tomasevic: When you talk about that ROI, what in particular has been really the standout key efficiency drivers when looking at marketing spend, particularly in a time when we know that budgets are going to be scrutinized, because of the weight of the world that's going on at the moment. We know it's a very tough time for everyone. How has that impacted how the senior stakeholders at Yours are allocating budget and getting that across?

Janine Quinn: So obviously, budgets are under scrutiny, but we're using that as a way to unlock our own channels. So we've seen a lot of consistency year- on- year with email campaigns, but I think we're really starting to see the revenue year- on- year from automated campaigns, which is my side. We're adding a lot of net new to our existing programs, but also optimizing what we already have. I think key for us is once we know something's work and we tend to roll it out across multiple markets and our other brands too. And so email is an area I think to watch this year. There's so much potential. And we actually have seen, as much as SMS does cost quite a bit for us to send out, we do see that that is a really effective channel for us. So you automatically see that impact from an SMS when we send it out, not just directly from that channel, but also there's a halo effect through the other channels too. We just see a lot more activity onsite and sales going up, which is great. I think for us as well with those own channels, it's a lot easier to personalize. So with paid social and paid search, a lot of the time you have to be a lot more generic just trying to get customers to site. But once we know you, it's a lot easier for us to recommend, get a bit more personal, and show you products you might be more interested in, or talk to you in a way that where we know where you are and the lifecycle. And I think app is also going to be a huge one for us this year. A lot of our efforts are now going to driving people to the app where we can send notifications. And we seem to have a lot more loyal customer base within the app.

Alice Tomasevic: Brilliant. So my definitely key takeaway from that that you just took us through was all around that personalization piece. And I'm glad you said that, because I think that's so, so critical, particularly when you're talking about own channels which, as a channel, is slightly that closer to consumer marketing. So that personalization is really at the heart of that, to ensure that when you are sending those communications, they're really speaking to the user at the right time and delivering the right message as well. So I think that's such a great thing that we can help achieve with Yours, which is fantastic. Going back to what we were talking about, the financial economy is not looking its best recently and into 2023. How has that really impacted your approach to navigating certain challenges and headwinds?

Janine Quinn: Andrew, our founder, came out with a price promise last year just to reassure customers in the cost- of- living crisis that prices aren't going to rise as we've seen in other industries. I think our main message that we like to push is the value and affordability of our clothing for the quality that you do get. I think it's a message that we're probably pushing a lot in our marketing channels at the moment, just to make sure the customer really understands. I think loyalty is going to be a big one for us this year. We're still trying to work out what the Yours loyalty program does look like. We haven't really done anything in the past, but we started a VIP program last year, so it worked really well for us over Black Friday, rewarding those loyal customers. So I think it'll be interesting to see how that evolves throughout 2023. I think app will be a big part of it, but we're still working out what we're going to do.

Alice Tomasevic: Yeah, that's good to know. I think that's definitely something I've heard across many different brands that we work with, at Wunderkind, is there is such now a push on that loyalty piece, because it's a very saturated market in most industries now, and so really trying to put yourself in the eyes of the consumer as that key differentiator is so important. And I love that price promise. I think definitely with the cost- of- living crisis, it's a tough time for a lots of people out there. That is such a great key differentiator against those competitors. As we know, it's a very competitive market, particularly on things like price. And going back to Yours' key brand value, quality is so critical and I know that's something many brands are struggling to get the balance right, so it's good to know it's very much at the heart of the Yours Clothing strategy. In your experience, what are some of the key factors that comes to when deciding where to allocate that marketing spend for future years?

Janine Quinn: I think you've got to look at how effective each of the channels is. We're obviously always going to have the largest budgets for that paid social and PPC. I think sometimes, the other channels could get a little bit overlooked, but I think with significant investment in things like Wunderkind for our email channel, I think it's going to be game- changing.

Alice Tomasevic: My next question is about the how you're measuring that return on investment. Because definitely in the industry, it's something everyone is so, so hot on in terms of making sure that any spend is going anywhere, particularly in times of a weaker economy is so critical. So how do you adjust your budgets and marketing allocations throughout the year when you're then able to see that return on investment in real time?

Janine Quinn: So I think similar to what I said earlier with the peaks and troughs of the year, we do see that as soon as the sun comes out, our customer loves to buy. So I think-

Alice Tomasevic: Who doesn't?

Janine Quinn: Exactly. I'll be getting those holiday outfits.

Alice Tomasevic: Exactly.

Janine Quinn: So I think we always monitoring spend. I think we work really closely with our paid agencies. I think they've got quite strict ROI targets, so we're always monitoring that and making sure that we're not overspending. I think sometimes, we will open up ROI and we can justify it if it's around a payday, something like that. But it's something that's, I guess, has a lot more eyes on it at the moment.

Alice Tomasevic: So, in your opinion, what do you think are the biggest challenges facing marketers and how would you overcome them?

Janine Quinn: So, for us, the main focus is on bottom- line revenue, what each channel's bringing in for the business. We don't have really set KPIs as such, which I think it's been a nice thing working with Wunderkind, just because you guys have almost brought those in for us. So we've got a set amount of subscribers that we're going to capture and a set ROI, which is all in that revenue guarantee. So I think it's been nice for a third party to come in and set those goals for us, almost saying what we could achieve, which, in this case, actually was probably more than we had expected.

Alice Tomasevic: Absolutely, and it goes back to that, I guess, revenue as a service. That's very much how Wunderkind and we'd like to position it. Because slightly differing from typical SaaS companies which are just selling that software, we are there to deliver performance. And so that's why I think in a recession, in particular for brands that we work with, like Yours and many others, it's so critical that we are held accountable, because that's the reason you partnered with us, and so, yeah, that's a great...

Janine Quinn: I feel like the team really care about helping us towards those targets as well. Obviously, it's beneficial for both of us, but I think we can work together to really achieve those.

Alice Tomasevic: I paid her to say that. Great. And then a couple of just final questions around the broader marketing sphere. Obviously, for Yours Clothing, you've got many sister brands operating in many different markets. How do you balance the localization versus personalization in an ever- changing consumer landscape?

Janine Quinn: I think it's something that we're still working on. So I think in the past we've been very UK- focused and maybe not given the international markets as much love as they might need. So we've got someone on the team now only focusing on international. She's doing an amazing job, tailoring that content to Germany or the Netherlands. We kind of looking at their calendars, seeing what events are important to them and making sure we can, not just follow the UK, which I think is what we've done in the past. I think for our other brands as well, something that works on Yours Clothing might not always work for our Long Tall Sally customer. They're completely different. So I think it's a case of trial and error and testing. Sometimes you're not going to get it right, but I think it's a learning curve and we're trying to work out what's best for each customer and each brand.

Alice Tomasevic: Yeah, absolutely. Completely agree. And I think definitely being able to have that local knowledge but still be able to take the efficiencies of being a big established brand in the UK is so critical. So that's good to see that this is further investment going into those areas, which is great. Next, I want to come on to a little bit more specifically to Wunderkind and why we're chatting today. So I wanted to talk to you about specifically the overall strategy that we, me and yourself, worked very closely on and how that helps you feel confident in Wunderkind and how we can deliver that performance for Yours.

Janine Quinn: I think in the onboarding process, I know that we had made it clear that senior leadership was against onsite email capture. I think in the past, when we have done it, we've done it through different providers who, although they've been very effective and we've managed to grow the database, that is it intrusive, is it annoying the customer, has been what we've been asked and there's not really been a way for us to combat that. I think it's been a while since we have had anything on the website. It's been hard to sign off. But I think when you guys came to us with a strategy of maybe having a sidebar, it's a little less in your face, what would work well for our brand and also not making it, making it, I guess, specific to the brand in our style, it looks slick. Since the sidebar's gone onsite, I've had different emails from the team going, " What is this? This looks wonderful."

Alice Tomasevic: Love that.

Janine Quinn: And it was like, "When when can we get it on the other sites?"

Alice Tomasevic: Amazing.

Janine Quinn: Ria, who's the Long Tall Sally manager, she dropped me an email with a screenshot of it like, " What is this? This is beautiful. Can we do this for Long Tall Sally?" I think it stands out. Because it's something we haven't done in such a long time. I think it's just exciting and the team's really getting behind it.

Alice Tomasevic: That's great, and that's something I personally love to hear, because I worked very closely on that, so that's great. And then, as well, when we were working on the strategy together, how did Wunderkind came to the table with help you get sign off from the senior stakeholders at Yours?

Janine Quinn: I think because we'd had the discussion beforehand on what had been rejected in the past, I think you guys had come to us with ideas that I was really confident to put in front of senior leadership. I think the sign- off process probably would've been a lot harder had we not had that chat about the designs. I think it was actually quite easy to get it signed off, especially with the promises you guys had made about how many subscribers we could help capture. I think it's been a really easy progress, process.

Alice Tomasevic: That's great. And I completely agree and echo that sentiment. I think it's been the smoothest onboarding, personally I've ever seen, across my experience. But I think that is such a testament to being incredibly honest with the feedback from your senior stakeholders right from the get go-

Janine Quinn: Yeah.

Alice Tomasevic: ...which I think really helped to streamline what it could look like for Yours. And timeliness of feedback was second to none.

Janine Quinn: I feel like we're quite a small team. We're very close- knit, so I think anything that comes back, we're shouting across the table like, " What do you think of this? What feedback have you got?" So it's really nice we can all collaborate and make those quick replies to you.

Alice Tomasevic: Yeah. No, that's great and we appreciated it. Great. And then, I guess, just taking a step back a little bit more and talking about the future of Yours Clothing, because that's definitely something I want to cover off today. How do you see that progressing over the next two to three to five years?

Janine Quinn: So I actually think, so I've been with Yours Clothing almost four years now, and even in that amount of time, the growth has been insane. Some of our best days from that first year are almost our everyday now. So I think, also since I've started, when I started, it was Your Clothing and Bad Rhino, we've acquired Long Tall Sally, we launched Pixie Girl last year. I think the growth, I can't see where it would stop. It's amazing to think of what it could look like in five years time, and hopefully, I can still be a part of that, just because I think it could be amazing.

Alice Tomasevic: Yeah, it definitely is something I'm really excited to see, and we'll be there on the journey with you, which is great. But you can definitely see how it's just continuing to grow exponentially over the next few years. And like you say, expanding the brands, expanding the global market presence. I think, yeah, the opportunities are endless. And then one thing I did just want to touch on finally is, it's been something that's been in the back of my mind recently is, we're actually starting to see in the news around the bounceback of the High Street, which I think is quite an interesting narrative, something we haven't really heard or seen since before COVID. And obviously, I know Yours, and some of the sister brands, have physical locations. So I just wanted to ask, where do you see that going for Yours Clothing over the next couple of years, and how has it been post- COVID?

Janine Quinn: So I think during COVID, we saw the growth of our e- commerce site. I think we probably weren't expecting it to start with, and then the growth was phenomenal. I think stores are still doing really well. We've got over a hundred stores at the moment. I think what I'd like to do is maybe work a little bit more closely. I think it's quite siloed at the moment. And though we've seen the growth in both areas, I think when it comes to putting those together, we may not as good as we can be. So we've just started doing e- receipts in stores and I want to be able to utilize that data in our other marketing channels, making sure, actually, if you've bought a coat in our store, I don't want to now advertise you coats. I think there's so many things we could do with it, but we just need to get the ball rolling a bit more.

Alice Tomasevic: Yeah, I think that's something that definitely we're seeing in that digital transformation piece over the past few years, which has definitely accelerated post- COVID, and so really trying to bridge that gap between offline to online is so critical and create that almost omnichannel experience.

Janine Quinn: I think it's important as well to know who our most valuable customers are. So I think we'll probably find that there are some people that are buying in- store every month and who have maybe only had a couple of online sales. But we maybe don't target them as much, because we actually can't see that side of it, so I think that could be a really interesting way to look at our customer base.

Alice Tomasevic: Yeah, absolutely. So really just maximizing that lifetime value-

Janine Quinn: Yeah.

Alice Tomasevic: ...of those really core Yours Clothing customers. Absolutely. Great. Well, thank you so much, Janine. It's been, as always, an absolute pleasure, and we'll be catching up very soon, I'm sure.

Janine Quinn: Yep.

Alice Tomasevic: But also, for the listeners out there, you can also catch Janine's fantastic impact story at wunderkind. co. And I'll sign off from now and say that's been another episode of Individuality Unleashed. Take care.