05-09-2022 Hot Topic: Loan Officer Recruitment Strategies

Automated: It's time for Lykken on Lending. Welcome, everybody. Good to have you with us. Welcome to Lykken on Lending, a weekly mortgage market update providing up- to- the minute information on interest rates, loan programs, and hot industry news all related to the mortgage industry brought to you by Transformational Mortgage Solutions. To participate in today's program, our guest call- in line is 646- 716- 4972. Now here's your host of Lykken on Lending, David Lykken. Let's begin.

David Lykken: Welcome, everybody. Good to have you with us. It is Monday, May 9, 2022. We say that because many of you listen on a downloaded basis, and we're thrilled to have you here, whether live or downloaded. Joining me here today is Jack Nunnery, of course, my co- host. This podcast is created by mortgage professionals. It is for mortgage professionals, and we're so grateful to have you as our listener. Our commitment is to bring you timely information in an audio format you can listen to anytime, anywhere. We got Josh Lehr coming on, who is senior director of partnerships and industry technology at Total Expert. Had a really interesting discussion. He's going to be bringing his thoughts about the challenges loan officers are facing right now and because of what's going on in this unusual loan officer recruitment and the impact that all that turnover is having on a lot of companies, so be sure to stay tune for the hot topic segment. A lot of great information from someone who has seen it from many, many angles. Also, want to say thank you to the Industry Syndicate. They do a great job of promoting our podcast, along with many others. Check out all the podcasts on industrysyndicate. com. A special thank you goes out to the Mortgage Bankers Association for all that they do for our industry. They also then say thank you to our sponsors, mortgage collaborative, Lenders One. Both of these are co- ops is where you co- op together, work in a more intimate setting to share best practices amongst the lenders. Also, us vendors show up, and we get a chance to connect with the mortgage banking community in a more intimate setting. So be checking out mortgage collaborative, Lenders One, but by all means being sure that you're still members, above all else, of the MBA. Also, we have Finastra, which is their mortgage bot solution. Does a great job of really helping you connect and create an experience that is seamless throughout all the processes. Really thrilled to have our longest standing sponsor we've had ever is Finastra with our fusion bot products. Also, Total Expert, again, the purpose- built CRM, customer engagement platform. You need to be paying attention to this one, folks, What Total Expert is doing in the way of automating, expanding this product. It is a leader already in the marketplace, but you're going to hear more in today's podcast of why. It's because Joe Welu and what he does and who he draws into this company. It is some serious, critical leadership that you're going to benefit from as we listen to the interview and the hot topics segment. Also, Knowledge Cube, grateful to have them as a sponsor. Check out the Knowledge Cube, the new platform. It's been launched. We are now going to be sharing our podcast on the coop. That's another way you can listen to the podcast, as well as Mobility MMI and Modex. Both these platforms have an intelligence helping you select the right people that you want to recruit that fit with your model. We're doing a lot of consulting in this area of recruiting right now, a lot of interest. You're going to be hearing about that again in the hot topic segment, but these two platforms will help you select the ones you want working for your company with the right product mix with the right geographics, right volume levels. Just so much information that both of these firms provide those of us in the mortgage industry. Also Snapdocs. They have some amazing tools and they support you in your eMortgage technology initiative. I want to encourage you to check out Snapdocs eMortgage Quickstart Program. You can do so by going to our website as well as going to Snapdocs. Also, SuccessKit does a great job helping your clients create videos that are compelling to talk about their experience with you, and it's quick and easy and so effective. Also, Lender Toolkit. I'm thinking of Brent Brumley and Brent Emler. These two characters are just dear friends of mine, and I just love what they do at Lender's Toolkit. Some of the most innovative things they're doing that fits like mortar in between all the bricks. You've got to check out all the various tools and technology that they've developed. Also, FormFree, Brent Chandler, grateful to have their partnership, as well as SimpleNexus. Laurie Brewers sold her company into SimpleNexus, and some of the things that they're doing there is just so innovative. Then, finally, I want to talk about DW Consulting. Debbie Wemyss does a great job at helping your team and your staff create really powerful, compelling LinkedIn profiles. It's so important that you tell your story about yourself and tell it well that fits with the rest of your company. So check out what Debbie does with her product and with her consulting, DW Consulting. So appreciate it. Also, a special thank you goes out to Rob, Les, Alice, Allen, Matt, and, of course, my cohost, Jack Nunnery. Listeners, I'm very excited to have Josh Lehr here. He's director of technology alliances at Total Expert. Josh, thanks for joining the podcast today.

Josh Lehr: Yeah. Glad to be here with you.

David Lykken: Well, let's let our audience get to know you a little bit. You having a Zillow background really intrigued me, so give us little insight into your career path.

Josh Lehr: Yeah, it's been pretty crazy. Since my college days, I've actually been working in financial services. I actually started out on the credit card side of the business, and about a decade ago, I made the transition to mortgage technology. I started a company called Mortech, which is a product and pricing engine in the mortgage space. But within my first six months, we actually got acquired by Zillow Group, which gave me a lot of different opportunities. I started out on the product side there, managing the pricing engine. But, then acquired by Zillow Group was able to take on a number of different responsibilities, including understanding new M& A opportunities that came in that were related to mortgage. But, then, also, from a partnership standpoint, doing a lot of industry coverage. So understanding who the players were in the space regarding LOS, point of sale, all of the new marketing and sales tech, and trying to figure out where there were opportunities for us. So a lot of exposure, a lot of opportunities to get out in the market and talk to different people about the experiences that they're building with consumers. For the last two years here, I made the transition to Total Expert to help build out a consumer direct offering. So super excited to be here.

David Lykken: Well, I'm excited to have you here and excited to have you on the podcast, especially when you bring that consumer direct. Many have struggled with that, but let's start at a broader perspective. Josh, talk about that many challenges that loan officers are facing right now. I know we have inventory issues. We have home price affordability issues with interest rates climbing as much as they have. Talk about the obvious and then maybe some of the not so obvious, from your perspective.

Josh Lehr: Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, we talk about inventory issues still being a problem even with the rising rates. I was actually talking to one of our top producers out on the East Coast, and she was talking to me about all of the preapproved borrowers she has. It's funny when you talk about having consumers ready to transact is one thing. You wouldn't expect that to be the problem, but the problem that she's running into is that she has these borrowers competing with each other over offers even in this rising rate environment. There's a couple things that you're seeing there. It's an interesting problem to have is having these preapproved borrowers, but now you're trying to find that inventory. So I think one of the big things that we see at Total Expert is the fact that these purchase cycles are just getting longer. With those rising rates, we see the ever changing preapproval. You're not seeing this static preapproval over time, so you're needing to stay engaged more with your consumers. I think that's a problem that loan officers are really running into is how do I stay in contact with that consumer over time and make sure I'm driving relevant messaging and checking in with them to make sure they're getting what they need to out of me because if I'm not there at the right time when they do finally find that property, that's not going to work out very well for me.

David Lykken: Again, we want to disclose you guys are a sponsor. Total Expert is a cherished sponsor of our podcast. We're grateful to have you. But want to also talk because we had Joe Welu on talking about some of the things that it's in his original vision for what it is, he's hired you. With your background, you're uniquely equipped to really help loan officers do this, but also advise on how consumers can use your technology effectively, so if you'd talk to that.

Josh Lehr: One of the things... This is even going back to my Zillow days, and I guess one of the reasons I'm here at Total Expert is because of the automation that we support on behalf of the loan officer. What we saw at Zillow through a number of studies is that the majority of consumers still want that trusted source they can go to give them that advice. Even your repeat borrowers are trying to understand what product is the best fit for them. The more that we can automate for that loan officer, so they can focus on the person and build that relationship and build that trust with them, the more value they can provide to that consumer. Really what we've done is we've said, okay, if we tie into the process all the way from the point of ingesting a lead or referral from a referral partner all the way through close, we're able to do things like supplement that messaging on their behalf, so they don't have to worry about checking with their loan processor to see if the appraisal came back and checking to make sure the underwriting was completed. We're able to grab that from the system and actually send that personalized message on that loan officer's behalf to the consumer, so that consumer feels that personal relationship coming through. It's almost a digital loan officer assistant is really what we're providing there.

David Lykken: Makes sense. I want to tie this back to your primary responsibilities director of technology alliances. How do the alliances play into this?

Josh Lehr: That's a big piece. I mean, obviously, we want to make sure that we're creating a very fluid ecosystem, like I said, all the way from the top of that funnel all the way through to the bottom, because while we can automate a lot on behalf of the loan officer, the automation is only as good as the data sources that we're putting into it. As we look at the different partners that are involved as a part of that loan origination process, it's very important for us to grab those data points and make sure we have a strong understanding of what's happening through that process, whether it's in the point of sale and making sure that consumer gets through the loan process. If they're not, let's figure out how we reach out to them, or through the closing process, making sure those milestones are hit, and we're keeping that loan officer informed. One of the things that we've done more recently is really around our customer intelligence product. This is, I think, what's really exciting as you talk about consumer engagement. There's a number of different ways that a consumer is engaging over time with different sources, whether that be shopping for other mortgage lenders and pulling their credit or potentially listing their property on the MLS or even more just indicative activities. Maybe they're shopping on certain websites. Those are the things where we're really looking to build this great ecosystem to understand more about the consumer, pair that with what's happening in their loan process, and drive those insights back to the loan officer, so they can reach out to the consumer when they are ready to transact.

David Lykken: How many loan officers understand how to use that information? One thing is to have the information. The other thing is to use it effectively. How many are struggling with that, in your opinion, Josh?

Josh Lehr: Yeah, I mean quite a few, and you can talk to the loan officer level. But even at the organization level, one thing that we identified even at Zillow is there's so many cool data sources that you have out there and people want to buy those data sources because they understand the insights. The problem is taking those insights and putting them to action. As you talk about putting them to action, one of the ways that we try and increase value for our users is not only by providing this automation or on behalf of, but also giving the blueprint, what we call our expert content, so that you can easily engage these things. Almost a set up and forget it, so as you talk about lead nurture journeys, having those out of the box with the specific content where you can plug in your logo and actually go and deliver this value. That's one thing that I think differentiates us is not only being a CRM, but that purpose- built CRM with so many different resources across our organization to help drive that success. We've seen the playbook. Let's help you implement that. I think that's one of the reasons we see such a high adoption rate. Our loan officer adoption rate right now is 91%. You see that because these loan officers aren't necessarily getting into the CRM on a regular basis, but they're enrolling their consumers in this automation because they understand the value it provides in building that relationship between them and the consumer.

David Lykken: The engagement at that level is unheard of. Most companies are struggling to get their loan originators involved with the technology that's being used, which is a complaint of business owners that I'm hearing is we buy this technology, the loan officers aren't using it. How did you achieve that level of adoption?

Josh Lehr: I think one of the things that we see is when we talk to these lending institutions, they find those high producers, and a lot of the high producers and our customers are actually leveraging this automation. They're leveraging this automation because it allows them to do more deals and focus on the consumer. You're not taking notes next to you, or you're not entering all of that data into the CRM. You're leveraging everything that's coming from this ecosystem that we've built to drive that automation and drive more deals. When they have that top producer, a lot of it's highlighting that. The cool thing is while these lending institutions are highlighting some of these high producers or highlighting some of the processes we're doing, we have a lot of people that are going out and building these types of materials and showing people how to do it. If you go out to LinkedIn, you see a lot of our top users that are actually going out and explaining what a journey is and how to build it and how powerful it is. That's a great feeling of validation is the fact that you have people that are advocates of your software, and you start to see, too, when these loan officers are moving, and being recruited from one organization to another, they're starting to ask that question. What do you have to support my automation? Do you have a total expert in place so that I don't have to be doing these things? I can focus on my consumers instead of focusing on the process.

David Lykken: I think you raise a good point. A lot of systems require a lot of input from loan officers, you, because of your particular director of technology alliances, you're bringing in that data, so it's a tool that they can use rather than having to interact with.

Josh Lehr: Right. There's definitely multiple ways they can engage within our platform because of the ecosystem that we've built with those lead source partners to bring those leads in, to drive that initial engagement with that consumer, so that consumer's reaching out to the loan officer. The point of sale to make sure that application's completed, and even those milestones throughout. That's where it's acting on behalf of that loan officer instead of requiring them to enter all of that within the platform itself.

David Lykken: One of the things you just brought up is recruiting loan officers. We're hearing that is one of the number one focus, loan officer retention and the loan officer recruiting. What is impacting a lot of loan officer turnover, in your opinion?

Josh Lehr: There's two pieces. One is the technology itself. But I think loan officers, over the pandemic, realize that I can be recruited to another organization, I can go somewhere else, I can get these huge bonuses. That's one thing, someone that's chasing that dollar. But, in addition to that, the other thing that you really see is that technology enablement. I can go make large margins somewhere, but if that's really painful for me, how much is that worth? As an originator, I want to have that support from my organization that you're going to give me that technology that's going to make this process seamless and easy for me. So as we talk about that recruiting impact, I think that's a big thing. Now, one of the things that's interesting, and we see some lenders do within our platform is they're not only using us for that origination process, but they're using our engine for that recruiting process.

David Lykken: I'm so glad you went there because I learned this when I was at the TMC event in Miami, and I heard Joe talking about this. I was talking about this, and he said," That is a feature we developed early on, but has not gotten a lot of focus." I think with what's going on in the market right now, and the attention on recruiting, this is an important point. What are some of the features within that?

Josh Lehr: One of the really cool things about this recruiting product and the fact that it uses the same workflows, obviously, being purposeful for recruiting... We have those use cases, but you talk about the engagement. The term that they always use is dogfooding. We are what we eat. So as you look at this, you see lenders that they're advertising through their recruiting process how they engage with consumers on your behalf. So you can use these automation tools when you get a new recruit in the platform. Let's send them the automated SMS engagement to schedule a meeting. Let's schedule those touchpoints through automated emails, or when people record in certain actions within the Total Expert platform as outcomes, let's drive that next engagement. The cool thing is you're able to advertise that through the process, but these are the tools we're going to offer you in terms of automation to drive better conversions with your consumers. The recruiting tools is something that's interesting. I talk about Jeff Walton. When I talk about their ingenious data, their core logic data, make sure you're focusing on recruiting the right people. Not only people that you're recruiting, but who are the people that you're losing. What does the outside look like? Are you recruiting better than what you're losing, and if you're not, you should probably look at new technology solutions to figure out how you do recruit and retain those types of loan officers that are the ones you want to get?

David Lykken: We do a lot of consulting and coaching on the area of recruiting, and this technology you have is really powerful to helping people do that. Now, talk about the importance of texting versus emails. We know the statistics. We've all heard them. For those that haven't, we're seeing a 97 to 98% open rate within seconds of receiving a text to open and read, and we're seeing a 27% open rate or lower and falling with emails. It's so important that we communicate via text. How does your system support texting?

Josh Lehr: The importance of texting... I mean, even go back to the Zillow days. We had that engagement with the consumers themselves, but even the engagement with the loan officer. You talk about getting the loan officer's attention. No one is sitting in front of their email and, anymore, your email inbox is so full of things, for those immediate action items, SMS is so important. That's why we're driving that more omnichannel approach through our marketing automation, so we have the ability to take those leads in or take that referral in from a landing page and send that automated SMS on behalf of the loan officer or send that automated email. You can support both channels, so regardless of where that consumer is wanting to interact, you can approach both channels and understand how they like to communicate. Now, the really cool thing is as you understand those preferences, you can modify those as well to make sure that's how you're communicating with them in the future. So the SMS has definitely been extremely powerful. So we have that one way automated SMS. Now the cool thing is we're pairing that with the two- way SMS product that we have available through some of our consumer- direct offerings today. So not only are you getting that automated outreach, but from a loan officer standpoint, you're starting to understand how that automated SMS is supporting your process and see that in line with your SMS communication as well. So there's definitely the automated being paired with the manual and having that complete picture of how you're communicating with the consumer over time. We've seen a lot of value and a lot of lenders are driving that initial connection through SMS just because they know it's going to be front and center for that consumer.

David Lykken: I think it's such an important point. The other thing you raised earlier, and I want to make sure we hit on that again is as you use this as a loan officer recruitment tool, you are showcasing the very technology they'll have available to them if they joined your firm. I think that's an important point.

Josh Lehr: Exactly. What better way to showcase it than actually use it. I think that shows a lot of trust in the technology that you've built with the people you're trying to recruit. If you can show them that and tell them what it is, it gives them that confidence in where they're going and the tools you're going to provide. Showing them a printout or an email is one thing, but actually using the tool is another.

David Lykken: That's such an important part of it. A lot of lenders are struggling with a lot of things going on in the market right now, but it seems like everyone's really focused on retaining loan officers and recruiting loan officers. Josh, with all of the focus on retaining loan officers and recruiting new ones, what are some of the things that you're seeing out there that is working better and helping companies be more successful than that endeavor?

Josh Lehr: I think the other thing is I see more and more lenders, even at the retail level, that are starting to serve up opportunities for their retail loan officers. Looking at how do you engage with consumers in this digital channel is definitely one thing that I've seen. Do we potentially supplement spend on leads from a Zillow or a Lending Tree to bring more traffic and opportunities forward for our loan officers. Now, in addition to that, I think there's the intelligence piece as well. This is, like I said, something that's fairly new to us. We're taking a lot of that data that was traditionally bought at the lender level through their data and analytics teams and then applied to models that they have, and then imported to systems like ours, and we're building that natively within the platform. This has really caught fire. The reason it's super exciting is because you can start to monitor the business that you have previously originated. You can understand what's happening in their lives, and you can bring those opportunities forward at the right time. Imagine that world where you're a top- producing loan officer and you're sitting there fighting for new business. What if you had this tool that was bringing information forward for you when your previous customers are ready to transact again? I think we talked about this a little bit earlier, but bringing in information about a consumer that listed their property. If they're listing their property, they're probably moving on somewhere else, driving those opportunities forward. You're not just prospecting new business. It's a lot about understanding more about your existing consumers that you've already built relationships to make sure that you are front and center when the time is right for that next transaction.

David Lykken: Josh, what are some examples of elements of the LO role that can be automated to not only free up their time, but also drive more opportunities for loan officers.

Josh Lehr: In terms of the automation, a lot of it is just the day- to- day communication. When you talk about trust building between a consumer and a loan officer, a lot of that happens on that first call that might last 15 or 30 minutes or that first interaction that you have, how do I learn more about what you're looking for in a loan? How do I make you trust in what we're providing from a product standpoint, making sure I'm getting you into the right product, and that I'm going to help you close and get the keys for that new property. A lot of the support activities beyond that are the things that we can automate, and a lot of that is because we have data signals on those things. Now, the cool thing is we talked about getting data signals from the point of sale and from the LOS and sending these automated emails and automated SMSs. We have some lenders that are even going a step further, and they're prerecording videos at certain points of the process that they can put into these emails. So you think about that personalized engagement. How can I create a video that talks about congratulations on your appraisal, here's your next steps in the loan process? Look forward to closing. We should be about 30 days out. Having those canned videos within the platform allows you to still have that personal touch even those these things are being automated.

David Lykken: That is such a good point. I'm really frustrated with the number of people that are not taking advantage of videos. They need to. It's so powerful. How can people overcome their resistance?

Josh Lehr: I think a lot of it is you have to take the plunge, and engage in video in its simplest form. You don't have to create an entire end- to- end strategy, but even those touch points that are really going to resonate with a consumer where you can build that relationship, I think are just good points to start. When I say that, what I really mean is think about the point of these purchase consumers. You have these purchase consumers that are out there, and they've been trying to buy a home for three, six, 12 months now because they've been competing with their friend across the street trying to figure out what property they're going to buy. That simple video recording of saying, hey, just a reminder, I'm here for you. If you want to talk more about your loan options or increasing your preapproval amount, give me a call. That's such a generic video, but because there's that relationship building that's going on, that personalization to say, hey, I'm here for you as a person. It drives so much engagement. You don't have to do an end- to- end video strategy, but just that one touchpoint will show you the power of it. Then it's going to make you want to do it for the full life cycle of those transactions.

David Lykken: I understand the resistance. I don't like the way I look. I don't like the way my voice sounds. I mean, those are all the things, but we've all been listening to your voice forever, listeners. Get used to it and step out there and start producing videos and just little video vignettes that you can stitch together. I think you raise a really good point that people can do. For example, with rising interest rates, I mean, to be able to communicate to the borrower what's going on and how it's happening with rates, I think, is maintaining that engagement. A lot of loan officers are going, yeah, but I don't know what I'm going to say. Rates have gone up. Some of the people we pre- qualified don't even qualify for the loans that we approved them for earlier. But this is the power of this tool. You came out of the Zillow. I think that brings so much value to Total Expert. What are you seeing that we need to do better as an industry that you learned at Zillow?

Josh Lehr: I think, as you go back to the Zillow days, a lot of the consumer studies that we did focused on communication. I think the one thing we always talk about, especially with these digital consumers is the push button, get mortgage. So that consistent engagement, especially that speed of engagement. How do we drive that automation to make sure that we're reaching out to that consumer right away or at least drive the automation so that way, it feels like we're reaching out right away because that's what those consumers crave. They want someone that they can contact at any time and be in touch with. I think this is where we can augment through the automation and you can even go even further augment through automation through our platform. But the other thing is augmenting through artificial intelligence. I think you're starting to see some chat bots out there that are really starting to communicate on behalf of the loan officer and give those answers in real time where maybe the loan officer's not available. I think that's the big thing that we learned is you have to have that speed of response. Without that speed of response, it degrades the trust that you have between the consumer and yourself. Driving that speed has always been a big thing and making sure that you're always available.

David Lykken: A great point. Josh, one of the new features I really love about the Total Expert system is a feature you recently launched. It was talked about again at the TMC meeting in Florida. It has to do with credit watch. Explain to our listeners what that is.

Josh Lehr: The credit watch is actually part of our customer intelligence product. What we're doing is we're taking either leads that you've purchased or maybe you're servicing portfolio or loans that you've previously originated with consumers, and we're enrolling these in these watches, the credit watch being one of those. What we're able to do is track that consumer's activity over time, so if they start to apply with a different lender... Maybe it's three years down the road, they're looking to refinance, and they want to apply with a different lender because your name wasn't front and center, it allows you to understand that consumer's shopping and reengage with that consumer. The cool thing is you can set those manual tasks and reminders for loan officers, so they can actually do that outreach through phone or SMS or email. But then we have these out- of- the box journeys as well that help support that process of reaching out to the consumer, whether that be generating the firm offer of credit letter that gets sent through direct mail or engaging through an automated SMS. Hey, this is Josh over at ABC Lending. Just wanted to check in and see if there's anything that I could help you out with. Just those simple touch points brings into focus for that consumer that, oh, yeah, I worked with Josh three or four years ago. I should probably go back and see what his rates are and see how he can help me since I've already built trust with that person.

David Lykken: Josh, what are some of the exciting things we can look forward to hearing about in future releases with Total Expert?

Josh Lehr: So definitely, we've talked about customer intelligence a number of times today, and I can't emphasize enough how far we're going into that. We talk about these very indicative moments of when a consumer's looking to transact, but we are actually looking to purchase additional data sets to get more of the understanding of when that consumer is looking to transact in the future. Understanding more about the consumer and making these use cases readily available within our platform, so lenders can take this information and actually drive it into action. That's something I'm extremely excited about. One of the things I'm super excited about is the growth of our ecosystem. When you talk about technology partners, we're expanding a lot of our existing integrations that we have when it comes to your mortgage ecosystem. But, then, we're also looking to bring in a number of other features to expand our offering for our lenders and loan officer users that maybe come from other industries. I think there's a lot of exciting things to come this year.

David Lykken: I'm excited about these, a vision that you all have and very pleased to have you as a sponsor. Thank you so much. You have given some great information here today. Josh, I really appreciate you taking time to be here with us. How can people connect with you? What's the most effective way, email, go to the website? What would you prefer?

Josh Lehr: Obviously, to learn more about Total Expert, definitely visit us at totalexpert. com, and also reach out to me on LinkedIn. I'm always open for a conversation about the industry and learning what people are doing out there that's new and innovative.

David Lykken: I recommend you listeners to pick up the phone call them, connect with them. LinkedIn, such a powerful tool with this messaging. More and more businesses coming to us through LinkedIn, and you should connect with Josh and find out about what his perspective is, especially when you look at your business and the things that you're pondering that might be unique. He's got tremendous experience. Again, that Zillow background that he has is just so powerful and bringing that knowledge and expertise to Total Expert and to our community. That's great. Thank you so much, sir. Appreciate you being here.

Josh Lehr: Thanks, David.

David Lykken: We're going to be diving into some developments on the conversational AI. I'll explain why when we get into it, but hoping to do that. As things developing, I see the need to bring back to our listening audience some really interesting technology that's out there, specifically, conversational AI. Talk you more about it, hopefully, next week. Good to have you with us. I want to say a special thank you to our sponsors, Finastra, Lenders One Mobility MMI, Modex, the MBA, Knowledge Coop, Mortgage Collaborative, Snapdocs, SuccessKit, Lender Toolkit, Total Expert for free and SimpleNexus. Thank you so much, everyone, for being here. Have a great week and look forward to seeing you back here next week.

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